Vortech question

[Chief Gilly]

Got the Vortech installed & tuned by Mustang Magic. Happy with the results for sure. I have done all mods myself except gears and SC. I am new to the supercharger world so I have a few questions. Don't mean to tweak the guys who have probably explained this a million times but here's my understanding of the two different setups and want to know if there's an advantage to either one.
I don't have an inter-cooler. Basic install with BPV. Stock MAF, Diablo Mafia.
Blow through is MAF setup before the throttle body after the BOV. Draw through (what I have) MAF in the beginning, BPV before throttle body, return to intake of SC'er. I think I got that right.
My question is there an advantage to BOV vs. BPV? I'm thinking that if you blow off excess compressed air the air inlet temps may reduce? If I want to change to BOV, do I have to change the plumbing? Is it worth it? Any change to this set up probably requires re-tune right?

Thanks

 

[dsblk93gt]

There is no advantage to either one, they do the same basic thing. You can't run a BOV unless you are blow thru since it will vent metered air. Draw thru works fine but blow thru is the best way.

 

[Chief Gilly]

There is no advantage to either one, they do the same basic thing. You can't run a BOV unless you are blow thru since it will vent metered air. Draw thru works fine but blow thru is the best way.

So I would have to change the plumbing then right? And if I did that I'd need to retune it. So I answered my own question. I guess it will stay like this for a while.

 

[On Edge]

There is no advantage to either one, they do the same basic thing. You can't run a BOV unless you are blow thru since it will vent metered air. Draw thru works fine but blow thru is the best way.

" if there is no advantage to either one" and "they do the same basic thing"........" then why is blow thru the best way" ?? just wondering

 

[On Edge]

Got the Vortech installed & tuned by Mustang Magic. Happy with the results for sure. I have done all mods myself except gears and SC. I am new to the supercharger world so I have a few questions. Don't mean to tweak the guys who have probably explained this a million times but here's my understanding of the two different setups and want to know if there's an advantage to either one.
I don't have an inter-cooler. Basic install with BPV. Stock MAF, Diablo Mafia.
Blow through is MAF setup before the throttle body after the BOV. Draw through (what I have) MAF in the beginning, BPV before throttle body, return to intake of SC'er. I think I got that right.
My question is there an advantage to BOV vs. BPV? I'm thinking that if you blow off excess compressed air the air inlet temps may reduce? If I want to change to BOV, do I have to change the plumbing? Is it worth it? Any change to this set up probably requires re-tune right?

Thanks

just wondering.....being that you just got this set-up....what made you think of this ? regarding lower air temps? is it running hot ? im also looking into the same set-up as yours as i have the same car. just trying to get educated. i heard you can just do meth injection, which will def lower temps without a big cost. wonder if you can do the meth vs the intercooler ?? thanks for the info everyone

 

[workmangc]

" if there is no advantage to either one" and "they do the same basic thing"........" then why is blow thru the best way" ?? just wondering

I won't say it is the "best" way, but it does have it's merits.

First, lets look at a draw through:

1. You have to recirculate the air from the bypass valve back to the inlet side of the compressor, but behind the MAF. This can induce poor accuracy in the MAF, affecting the driveability

2. The air passing through the blower above, and again after getting recirculated will increase in temperature.

3. Recirculating stinks, but you cannot just dump to atmosphere or you will get huge rich spikes which will kill driveability.

4. When you add and intercooler/aftercooler to the equation, you have a substantial length of tubing from the meter to the TB, which leads to a delay from what the MAF is seeing, to what the motor is actually getting.

Looking at a blow through:
1. No need to recirculate air that induces poor accuracy.

2. You can dump to atmosphere, before any intercooler so you don't waste energy cooling air that is going to get dumped.

3. Meter can be right before the TB so there is little to no delay between what the meter reads, and what the motor ingests.

The above isn't an all inclusive list, and I suggest you do your own research, but this is from a guy who has had nitrous, supercharged with a draw through, and now a turbo car with a blow through set up.

 

[Chief Gilly]

just wondering.....being that you just got this set-up....what made you think of this ? regarding lower air temps? is it running hot ? im also looking into the same set-up as yours as i have the same car. just trying to get educated. i heard you can just do meth injection, which will def lower temps without a big cost. wonder if you can do the meth vs the intercooler ?? thanks for the info everyone

Actually i haven't had the chance to drive it too much. I have not had issues with the temps, yet. Just trying to get a better understanding myself. I was wondering the same as you were though if blow threw and draw threw are the same why is one better. The MAF may work more accurately in one case vs. the other. The MAF as on a N/A induction was a draw threw to start with, from the factory. So to change it to a blow threw I would think would be putting it in an application it wasn't intended for, but may make no difference.
I do understand the concept of discharging metered air Vs. non-metered air and it makes sense.
Thanks Workmangc, your explanation of the difference makes me wish I had blow threw instead. As if i added a BOV or intercooler I wouldn't have to change that much of the plumbing, but would need a re-tune if I added either one.
That is one of the addictions is understanding new stuff and making it work. Just having to re-tune can get expensive. I'll enjoy it as it is for a while!

 

[Chief Gilly]

just wondering.....being that you just got this set-up....what made you think of this ? regarding lower air temps? is it running hot ? im also looking into the same set-up as yours as i have the same car. just trying to get educated. i heard you can just do meth injection, which will def lower temps without a big cost. wonder if you can do the meth vs the intercooler ?? thanks for the info everyone

I was checking out the meth injection too. The snow performance stage 2 looks to be more accurately controlled but the thought of injecting H2O into the intake has me a little nervous. With high temps it probably vaporizes quickly. I wonder if you would have to go with blow threw to use it? Probably go with 2 settings one for Summer and one for late Fall-Early Spring. IDK I'd need more info on it, but is cheaper than intercooler.

 

[Chief Gilly]

Don't mean to bust my own thread but with this new found speed I think I'm gonna need an upgrade over the stock GT brakes too

 

[On Edge]

I was checking out the meth injection too. The snow performance stage 2 looks to be more accurately controlled but the thought of injecting H2O into the intake has me a little nervous. With high temps it probably vaporizes quickly. I wonder if you would have to go with blow threw to use it? Probably go with 2 settings one for Summer and one for late Fall-Early Spring. IDK I'd need more info on it, but is cheaper than intercooler.

1) thanks for the very detailed reply workmangc !! thanks.

2) cheif gilly.....you and i are on the same page. i was also thinking of methanol injection vs an intercooler. like i said before, i am also thinking about the vortech kit. if you go to the snow website and google snow, there are very detailed conversations about methanol. sounds like a great option. by the way....you are not injecting water....you are injecting a methanol / water (50/50) mix that absorbs heat and vaporizes and cools the air temp. from what i understand, it works/sprays based upon boost levels. its very cool to read about...and its not new tech, actually its been used forever. as a novice like you, i was going to start a new thread about methanol.

 

[Chief Gilly]

I did a search on the meth injection on this sight and there is some good posts about it already you can read. I have found the Anderson Meth injection system uses pure meth and no pump. It uses the vacuum of the blower to pull the meth out of your container. Less parts to fail. You can get idiot lights to tell when your low on meth in the tank, and when tuning you can setup so if your IATs go up to a set limit it will retard timing. It does this because something has gone wrong with the injection and the temps are higher then if it was running. What can be a problem is getting a tuner to put in the extra timing that the meth makes up for because if there's a problem with the meth your engine can go boom. Having a draw through system is the only way to run the meth cause you don't want the meth to run through the MAF. On the Anderson unit you inject/suck the meth into the blower itself and the impeller mixes it with the air.
What do you think about that?

 

[Chief Gilly]

It's called Anderson Mr. Freeze. Meth technology used as far back as it was used on the P-51 Mustang Merlin engine. Although reading on the sight of the name Anderson Ford Motorsport it's a mix of H2O and meth. I saw one system that does use pure meth and they modified the pump to handle pure meth, don't remember what sight now though.
An intercooler seems safer to me though as there are no moving parts to rely on. If I had to do it now I'd go with intercooler but like I said I'll enjoy it the way it is for a while. I want to get a wide-band air/fuel gauge first. So there's a few bucks in new pod (cheap) and gauge ($200+). If I switch to blow through I'll get a larger MAF too so money is the issue with changing it up. Plus I just got the dang blower installed. Modding is outa control sometimes

 

[workmangc]

You don't "run out" of air with an intercooler vs' a meth kit.

Regarding the gauges, I wish I knew, I just gave away a dual gauge pod and UPR Off road x-pipe.