66 fastback, installing quarter skins?
- Thread starter FastbackGregy
- Start date
Never done one before but here's a link to Mustang Monthly , pretty detailed, it's done on a coupe but I wouldn't think it's any different... Good Luck
http://www.mustangmonthly.com/projectbuild/mump_0102_quarter_panel_repair/index.html
http://www.mustangmonthly.com/projectbuild/mump_0102_quarter_panel_repair/index.html
Thanks for the Mustang Monthly link on quarter repair. I have read that link and it was helpful. Just wondering if anyone has ever done a quarter skin on a fastback. I think the new skin is the same size as far as the height to the top of the old quarter. I was told by a mustang shop that using a skin on a quarter is not reccomended, but can be done.
Greg
Greg
Hey Greg,
I've changed just about every piece of metal on an early Mustang.If you look at my photo album,I have some pictures of a coupe that I skinned. That said I have done quarters on coupes,convertibles,and fastbacks, Using NOS Pieces,repo full quarters, repo skins, and repo patch pieces. Personally I would try to salvage whatever original sheetmetal you can. Do you have any pictures of the rust damage on your car? If it's a rot out that's one thing, If it's just lower patches I'd probably just patch. I decided a while back that I will never do another skin again,I'm either doing lower patches or full quarters. If you need to pick my brain at all,feel free.
I've changed just about every piece of metal on an early Mustang.If you look at my photo album,I have some pictures of a coupe that I skinned. That said I have done quarters on coupes,convertibles,and fastbacks, Using NOS Pieces,repo full quarters, repo skins, and repo patch pieces. Personally I would try to salvage whatever original sheetmetal you can. Do you have any pictures of the rust damage on your car? If it's a rot out that's one thing, If it's just lower patches I'd probably just patch. I decided a while back that I will never do another skin again,I'm either doing lower patches or full quarters. If you need to pick my brain at all,feel free.
Hey Ponyboy, Thanks for the info about the quarter panels. I do have some questions to ask you. Why wouldn't you do a skin again? My quarters are pretty gone, but the top part is good. So I think a skin would work. I could do a full quarter, but at $400 vs $60 for a skin. Here's a link to my fastabck with a few pictures. http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=akwpmum.9shxp0bi&x=0&h=1&y=-dj4kd9&localeid=en_US
You can e-mail me at ggregory@rochester.rr.com with your comments.
Thanks, Greg
You can e-mail me at ggregory@rochester.rr.com with your comments.
Thanks, Greg
Here are some more pictures. http://www.kodakgallery.com/ShareLanding.action?c=akwpmum.79oq952e&x=0&h=1&y=7lr67y&localeid=en_US
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Hey Barry,
That car is all done now except for paint,I have to finsh sand and prime etc. Unfortuntaley for that car A few new additions got added and life got in the way a bit.But metal wise it's set.That's my Taiwan car,because most of it's metal came from There. That car is nothing compared to the metal I'm going to have to change on my red 66,unfortunately it's a rot box but it's my first car and I'm a sentimental fool.You do still have a long way to go on your car,but it will get there.
Greg,
Forget what I said about skins,I said that because the skins I used on that car were a pain in the a$$,I know they have gotten better since then.I was also thinking about Coupes and Convertibles. After viewing your pictures I would say skins are the way to go.If I had a fastback with rotted quarters like yours (oh wait,I do) but the area above the body line and around the vents was good,Like yours appears to be?I'd leave it alone. Are you going to be doing your own metal work? If you are let me know,I will give you some step by step thoughts and if you don't already have them I'll recommend a couple of tools,books that will help you,etc.Either way feel free to pick my brain. Make sure your tetus shot is current.LOL. I'm kidding but I'm not.
That car is all done now except for paint,I have to finsh sand and prime etc. Unfortuntaley for that car A few new additions got added and life got in the way a bit.But metal wise it's set.That's my Taiwan car,because most of it's metal came from There. That car is nothing compared to the metal I'm going to have to change on my red 66,unfortunately it's a rot box but it's my first car and I'm a sentimental fool.You do still have a long way to go on your car,but it will get there.
Greg,
Forget what I said about skins,I said that because the skins I used on that car were a pain in the a$$,I know they have gotten better since then.I was also thinking about Coupes and Convertibles. After viewing your pictures I would say skins are the way to go.If I had a fastback with rotted quarters like yours (oh wait,I do) but the area above the body line and around the vents was good,Like yours appears to be?I'd leave it alone. Are you going to be doing your own metal work? If you are let me know,I will give you some step by step thoughts and if you don't already have them I'll recommend a couple of tools,books that will help you,etc.Either way feel free to pick my brain. Make sure your tetus shot is current.LOL. I'm kidding but I'm not.
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Hey Ponyboy. I know this fastback is a lot of work, but I have done some pretty bad mustangs in the past, this is by far the worst though. Yes I will be doing all the metal work and welding. I have replaced just about everything except quarters. I send that part of the job out, but I figure I could do a decent job to my standards so I want to do this car with the quarters. I also do my own painting. The top part of the quarters and vent area are near perfect, just been painted to many times. Original color is Candy Apple Red. What tools can you recomend? I'm not sure where to weld the top of the skin to. The ridge or a little down. Someone told me to over lap part of the old quarter over the new skin, then tap it in when still hot when welding, followed by bondo over that seem. Others said to butt weld them together. I figured I would try a skin myself, if I screw it up it's less then a $100 I lost. But still had fun trying, lesson learn too. I'm ready for ideas and help.
Thanks,
Greg
Thanks,
Greg
Hey Greg,
If you've done metal work before I'm sure you'll do a good job.I'm no metal fabricater/master welder believe me.I am too cheap to pay someone else to do it and more importantly I enjoy doing the work.I go through phases where I enjoy working on the cars more than driving them.Besides that I have seen some work that was done by "Pros" and I was scared,I've known a bunch of people who basically paid a pro to screw up their car. I'm not trying to dis all pros,I just know with old cars and especially when it comes to rust repair people have to be careful.
Anyhow Moving along. The way I was taught to do skins and the way I do them is to is to overlap a bit. If you take a look at my photos you will see where I made my cut below the top of the quarter.Just about where yours are cut off on your car. I then use a Flange/hole punch tool (tool recommendation #1 if you don't already own one? ) If you want info I can give you a Harbor Freight tool #. I flange the seam that is on the car inward.I trim the top off of the repo skin(They come slightly bent at the top). I then lay the skin over the original quarter flange. I drill holes along the seam through both panels .I use Cleco fasteners (Tool Recommendation #2) to hold the panels together If you look closely at my photo you can see them in place on the almos there picture. Some people use screws instead of clecos. The clecos are very handy, If you want to get the panels closer together you can always use screws to pull them together tighter. If you need an assist on where to get Clecos and the wrench let me know? Eastwoods sells them but if you look on places like ebay you can get a setup for a fraction of the price.
Ok calling a spade a spade,The repo quarter skins are a bit flimsy so I like the flange method because it gives it some strength. You can tap down the welds lightly when you do them? If you do the flange right you will basically be welding in a valley between the two panels so you shouldn't have to hit it down at all,You will grind down the welds when you are done. You can then fill with your filler of choice,On my first coat I use something with some backbone to it,usually a Fiberglass filler medium or small hair,Then I move onto a polyester filler or similar. Most importantly the skins are very susceptible to warpage so I move all over the place when I weld them.I'll do one on the end,then go to the other side basically I move aroung alot so I don't super heat a specific area. So that's basically my two cents. If you need a heads up on where to get the tools let me know,You may already own them? Feel free to pick my brain on anything or share any info that you find helpful,I'm always looking to learn something new.
What other Mustangs do you have? Or have you worked on? What did you replace,etc?
If you've done metal work before I'm sure you'll do a good job.I'm no metal fabricater/master welder believe me.I am too cheap to pay someone else to do it and more importantly I enjoy doing the work.I go through phases where I enjoy working on the cars more than driving them.Besides that I have seen some work that was done by "Pros" and I was scared,I've known a bunch of people who basically paid a pro to screw up their car. I'm not trying to dis all pros,I just know with old cars and especially when it comes to rust repair people have to be careful.
Anyhow Moving along. The way I was taught to do skins and the way I do them is to is to overlap a bit. If you take a look at my photos you will see where I made my cut below the top of the quarter.Just about where yours are cut off on your car. I then use a Flange/hole punch tool (tool recommendation #1 if you don't already own one? ) If you want info I can give you a Harbor Freight tool #. I flange the seam that is on the car inward.I trim the top off of the repo skin(They come slightly bent at the top). I then lay the skin over the original quarter flange. I drill holes along the seam through both panels .I use Cleco fasteners (Tool Recommendation #2) to hold the panels together If you look closely at my photo you can see them in place on the almos there picture. Some people use screws instead of clecos. The clecos are very handy, If you want to get the panels closer together you can always use screws to pull them together tighter. If you need an assist on where to get Clecos and the wrench let me know? Eastwoods sells them but if you look on places like ebay you can get a setup for a fraction of the price.
Ok calling a spade a spade,The repo quarter skins are a bit flimsy so I like the flange method because it gives it some strength. You can tap down the welds lightly when you do them? If you do the flange right you will basically be welding in a valley between the two panels so you shouldn't have to hit it down at all,You will grind down the welds when you are done. You can then fill with your filler of choice,On my first coat I use something with some backbone to it,usually a Fiberglass filler medium or small hair,Then I move onto a polyester filler or similar. Most importantly the skins are very susceptible to warpage so I move all over the place when I weld them.I'll do one on the end,then go to the other side basically I move aroung alot so I don't super heat a specific area. So that's basically my two cents. If you need a heads up on where to get the tools let me know,You may already own them? Feel free to pick my brain on anything or share any info that you find helpful,I'm always looking to learn something new.
What other Mustangs do you have? Or have you worked on? What did you replace,etc?
Ponyboy, I'm not a pro welder by any means, but I can weld good enough. Maybe as good as a person who gets paid to do a bad job at times, ha ha. I know what you mean when someone pays to have a job done and it sucks! One of my first mustangs I did I paid a guy to do some welding for me and install some new metal. When I got the car back it didn't look right. I think the next day I went out and bought a cutting torch outfit and a Hobart 140 mig welder and learned my self with some help from the company I bought the welder from. From then I I have been doing my own welding and etc, but not quarters, YET! I have done complete frame rails, torque boxes and convertible Rocker's, plus some other easy parts. I also need to take out my cowl on this fastback and weld in a new one piece cowl. I have never done one before.
I will need to know where did you ge your tools you mentioned from. I'm sure I can find them on line. I have used clamps and screws to keep the metal together if needed, but I know those Clecos are good. I need to get them. I will also get the Flange Hole punch as well.
I'm sure I can get a new skin on, but to make the job look good/correct I will need to get the car's lines to match up even. Quarter to doors and quarter to rear extensions. Looking at the quarter now it would seem correct to take off one side at a time as in do around the door first. Take a good measurement where the edge of the old quarter is and make sure you weld it back at the same spot. Then do the same at the rear, followed by welding the quarter using the over lap method. Doors I have heard should be on the car, but does it really matter? The doors can move some both in closer/away to/from the car and from front to back. Same as with the fenders.
But first before I do any quarter work I need to weld in a new taillight panel and then the full frame rails which have the torque boxes already welded to the frame rails. Then I have a new full one piece trunk/transition pan that needs to go on top of the frame rails and that pan also needs to be welded to the rear taillight panel. This sounds like a big job, but really it's not that hard, you just need 4 hands and clamps to hold everything in place before you can get a weld in. I have a old friend that I grew up with that owns his own collision shop. He use to also weld Mustangs. I have talked to him and he's says, no big deal, just call me when your ready and I'll be right over, BINGO! But I have never seen any of his work, but I trust him.
I have the 66 fastback A-code 4 speed car that I'm working on now. I also have a very solid 66 GT coupe, 4 speed that's about 95% all there. I'm thinking about redoing that car and give it to my daughter when she graduates from college in 3 years, or I may sell it, or I will use it as a parts car. Here are some other mustangs I have owned in the past. 65 K-code 4- speed fastback, I never drove this car and I stupidly sold it to a father/son for them to restore. This was back in 1984? I have owned 5- 65 mustang T-codes coupes and drove all of them, autos and 3 speeds, one C-code auto 67 coupe, a very nice 67 convertible C-code auto that I drove for about 3 years and towed my Jet Ski with the factory hitch. A beat 67 S-code coupe that I striped for the parts and sold after that about a year ago. I have also worked on some other peoples mustangs at times too.
I will pick your brains.
Greg
I will need to know where did you ge your tools you mentioned from. I'm sure I can find them on line. I have used clamps and screws to keep the metal together if needed, but I know those Clecos are good. I need to get them. I will also get the Flange Hole punch as well.
I'm sure I can get a new skin on, but to make the job look good/correct I will need to get the car's lines to match up even. Quarter to doors and quarter to rear extensions. Looking at the quarter now it would seem correct to take off one side at a time as in do around the door first. Take a good measurement where the edge of the old quarter is and make sure you weld it back at the same spot. Then do the same at the rear, followed by welding the quarter using the over lap method. Doors I have heard should be on the car, but does it really matter? The doors can move some both in closer/away to/from the car and from front to back. Same as with the fenders.
But first before I do any quarter work I need to weld in a new taillight panel and then the full frame rails which have the torque boxes already welded to the frame rails. Then I have a new full one piece trunk/transition pan that needs to go on top of the frame rails and that pan also needs to be welded to the rear taillight panel. This sounds like a big job, but really it's not that hard, you just need 4 hands and clamps to hold everything in place before you can get a weld in. I have a old friend that I grew up with that owns his own collision shop. He use to also weld Mustangs. I have talked to him and he's says, no big deal, just call me when your ready and I'll be right over, BINGO! But I have never seen any of his work, but I trust him.
I have the 66 fastback A-code 4 speed car that I'm working on now. I also have a very solid 66 GT coupe, 4 speed that's about 95% all there. I'm thinking about redoing that car and give it to my daughter when she graduates from college in 3 years, or I may sell it, or I will use it as a parts car. Here are some other mustangs I have owned in the past. 65 K-code 4- speed fastback, I never drove this car and I stupidly sold it to a father/son for them to restore. This was back in 1984? I have owned 5- 65 mustang T-codes coupes and drove all of them, autos and 3 speeds, one C-code auto 67 coupe, a very nice 67 convertible C-code auto that I drove for about 3 years and towed my Jet Ski with the factory hitch. A beat 67 S-code coupe that I striped for the parts and sold after that about a year ago. I have also worked on some other peoples mustangs at times too.
I will pick your brains.
Greg
Hey Greg,
Places like eastwood sell the Cleco's but I'm not a fan of over paying so I bought them somewhere else,I might have bought them on Ebay? To give you an idea go to ebay and take a look at aution #260391689520 That looks like a decent deal. Basically you will need the fasteners and the pliers.I didn't look on there too much but if you scour around you will probably find a better deal,I think they are pretty handy. The panel flanger is very helpful as well,I bought the harbor freight tool which is fone for a weekend warrior,I broke one because I was using it to punch holes and one of the little pieces got lodged in it and broke it,so now I only use them for flanging.
As far as the quarters,I would definately try to do one side at a time.I would try to line up the doors as best you can and definately leave them on,I think they are a great alignment tool.Even though they are pretty adjustable they will help you get the proper angle with the new skin in terms of the "C" Area.I wouldn't worry about the fenders. The door to quarter alignment is very important,you can always massage the fenders to line up with the doors later.
It's good that you have a friend who is willing and able to lend a hand and a body shop. It definately sounds like you have your work cut out for you. Please take a bunch of pictures and pass along any info that you think will be helpful.I've changed a lot of metal on early Mustangs but I don't think I've doen that much to one yet? I've never changed a complete rear rail,I've done a bunch of short rears and fixed rear torque boxes.One of these days/years (if I'm around long enough) I'm going to be doing a ton of metal replacement on my first car,which I still have it's pretty rusty.So I'm appreciative to any pointers (things I didn't think of?)you may have to aid me in replacing the frame rails,etc.
Now I'll tell you why I may not get to that car (my first car)for a while........ My current fleet (herd) consists of :
1) 65 CONV "C" Code car powered by a legit Hipo with a 4 speed disc brakes,etc.
2) 66 sprint 6 cylinder convert
3) 65 "A" G.T. Convert (My wifes car)
4) 66 "C" convert,basket case I'll probably never get to it.
5) 66 "A" G.T. Fastback
6) 65 C code fastback (basically sold)project
7) 66 c code fastback project( going to be sold)rusty
8) 66 "K" G.T. Coupe
9) 66 c code coupe (ex race car,future vintage race car)
10) 66 c code coupe (my first car) major project
11) 65 c code coupe (my taiwan car) the one in my photo album
12)66 sprint 6 cylinder coupe auto project car (going to unload it)
13) 68 6 cylinder auto coupe,I've paid for it,I don't pick it up until tomorrow,I think that counts? Not sure what I'm going to do with this? I'm thinking of running around in it for a while and possibly selling it.
I like projects and I love drivers so they are all works in progress.I try to pick up my cars cheap,not running, needing work. I've had a bunch of Mustangs that I've sold as well.Man I have a tolerant wife. On A srious note how long ago did you sell your "K" car? How/where did you sell it (ebay,craigslist,etc.)? I wonder if we've met or if I ever saw the car? Do you happen to have any "K" Parts? I'm looking for some pieces.By the way If you are looking for anything,let me know? I have alot of parts to sell/trade.If you have parts to sell or trade let me know as well,as I am always looking for parts for myself and my friends.
Places like eastwood sell the Cleco's but I'm not a fan of over paying so I bought them somewhere else,I might have bought them on Ebay? To give you an idea go to ebay and take a look at aution #260391689520 That looks like a decent deal. Basically you will need the fasteners and the pliers.I didn't look on there too much but if you scour around you will probably find a better deal,I think they are pretty handy. The panel flanger is very helpful as well,I bought the harbor freight tool which is fone for a weekend warrior,I broke one because I was using it to punch holes and one of the little pieces got lodged in it and broke it,so now I only use them for flanging.
As far as the quarters,I would definately try to do one side at a time.I would try to line up the doors as best you can and definately leave them on,I think they are a great alignment tool.Even though they are pretty adjustable they will help you get the proper angle with the new skin in terms of the "C" Area.I wouldn't worry about the fenders. The door to quarter alignment is very important,you can always massage the fenders to line up with the doors later.
It's good that you have a friend who is willing and able to lend a hand and a body shop. It definately sounds like you have your work cut out for you. Please take a bunch of pictures and pass along any info that you think will be helpful.I've changed a lot of metal on early Mustangs but I don't think I've doen that much to one yet? I've never changed a complete rear rail,I've done a bunch of short rears and fixed rear torque boxes.One of these days/years (if I'm around long enough) I'm going to be doing a ton of metal replacement on my first car,which I still have it's pretty rusty.So I'm appreciative to any pointers (things I didn't think of?)you may have to aid me in replacing the frame rails,etc.
Now I'll tell you why I may not get to that car (my first car)for a while........ My current fleet (herd) consists of :
1) 65 CONV "C" Code car powered by a legit Hipo with a 4 speed disc brakes,etc.
2) 66 sprint 6 cylinder convert
3) 65 "A" G.T. Convert (My wifes car)
4) 66 "C" convert,basket case I'll probably never get to it.
5) 66 "A" G.T. Fastback
6) 65 C code fastback (basically sold)project
7) 66 c code fastback project( going to be sold)rusty
8) 66 "K" G.T. Coupe
9) 66 c code coupe (ex race car,future vintage race car)
10) 66 c code coupe (my first car) major project
11) 65 c code coupe (my taiwan car) the one in my photo album
12)66 sprint 6 cylinder coupe auto project car (going to unload it)
13) 68 6 cylinder auto coupe,I've paid for it,I don't pick it up until tomorrow,I think that counts? Not sure what I'm going to do with this? I'm thinking of running around in it for a while and possibly selling it.
I like projects and I love drivers so they are all works in progress.I try to pick up my cars cheap,not running, needing work. I've had a bunch of Mustangs that I've sold as well.Man I have a tolerant wife. On A srious note how long ago did you sell your "K" car? How/where did you sell it (ebay,craigslist,etc.)? I wonder if we've met or if I ever saw the car? Do you happen to have any "K" Parts? I'm looking for some pieces.By the way If you are looking for anything,let me know? I have alot of parts to sell/trade.If you have parts to sell or trade let me know as well,as I am always looking for parts for myself and my friends.
