380 RWHP ... 2V N/A possible?

BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#1
#1
Ok .... am I trippin'?

My plans were always to buy a forged, stroked shortblock and throw a KB on top, but I think my plans are changing again.:rolleyes:

The price for the shortblock, KB set-up, and the issues of upgrading the fuel system, transmission and rearend at once don't make me :D. :nono::nono:

MHS has a few articles where they hit 300RWHP with a PI swapped and cammed 2v.
ModularHeadShop real world 300RWHP combo
One build went 330RWHP with stage 3 heads & cams.
ModularHeadShop Recession Buster 2V combo


My question is what could I expect from a build like this ...

MMR 900 stroker w/ FRPP big bore iron block. (323ci/5.3L)
My MMR stage 2 PI heads
MHS stage 3 N/A cams
FRPP bullit racing intake
Stock cobra 39# injectors & a BAP
w/ 10.1 CR pistons

IF MHS can reach 300-330whp with the 4.6L, it seems reasonable that I could reach 380 with a 5.3L ... right?


380-400ish is what stock 2v's w/SC are running and that puts them towards the top of the stock internals limit. If I could reach that power and still be N/A with the bonus of just starting to scratch the potential of the motor I'd be :awesomework::D:D:awesomework:.

This is something for next winter, not this one. I'm just in the " horse is hibernating ... owner is dreaming" portion of the year.:smash:
 
S

slvrgt

Well-Known Member
#3
#3
u shuld have no prob hittn that mark with the mmr motor. my 02 with a stock motor, heads and cams im over 300.
 
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BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#4
#4
The trick flow heads are not an option. I almost pulled the trigger on them when I bought my MMR stage 2 PI heads. The TF's were released that month but the $600 difference was not in the cards at that time. So to spend $2k on heads again won't go over to big on the home front.;)

My biggest problem is an intake and the CR.

I'm still thinking FI down the road but with the money I'm going to spend on this project I'd like to hit 380whp N/A. I was thinking 10.1 CR would be a good middle point but even that is not very boost friendly.

For an intake to work good with the stage 3 cams I need it to flow to 7K+ rpm. There are intakes out there that will do that but they sacrifice torque below 4K. The car is not going to be a track car (vert w/o a cage gets booted at 13.49) so I still want the lower rpm torque for street use.

I still have gobs of time. I was just throwing this idea out there to see if 380 N/A is just a pipe dream or if it was worth putting in the legwork on research. So far I'm still encouraged to continue my plans.
 
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MaximumRisk

MaximumRisk

NYC Regional Coordinator
#6
#6
that is some nice hardware, but my advice to you (assuming you want to run pump gas) is to put the engine together, but keep compression at around 9 to 9.25:1 and get what you get out of it N/A and when the $$ allows to add the power adder the engine will be ready for it and you won't have to spend more money/down-time rebuilding for lower compression.
In the other hand, IF you have e85 available to you locally, then build your high compression motor and when time for a blower comes just run e85
 
BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#7
#7
Waldo I'm still 12 months out on ordering anything. Right now is just a planning stage but a build like this needs all the planning it can get. With the coin I'm gonna drop on it I'd like to reach what a stock GT makes with a SC, upper 300's. I'm not sure I can get there under 10.1CR. I could have just put a SC on top of the stroker SB w/ my heads and a good cam and made 550+ to the wheels but I won't have the money to do the tranny and rear with it. My stock T45 wouldn't like that for long. I figure at 380+ I'd be ok for a little while.:D


OrangeRob runs E85 so it it available locally somewhere. I'm thinking intercooled w/ meth injected and E85 would still be fine with boost when I go there. But that is a long way out.

Right now I'm trying to find out what's needed to turn 7k+rpms. I've heard the ignition on the 96-98 can do it but not the 99-04's?

For intakes I really like the BBK dual runner intake but haven't seen any real world teating on it yet.



The Logan intake is huge, and I haven't found much info on it for N/A builds.



And then there's the Edlebrock that flows to 7500 and doesn't lose too much on the lower end.

And so the research continues ... :rock:
 
TBapp3

TBapp3

Northern NY Regional Coordinator
#8
#8
I know trick flow also has an intake also Bert ... I'd post the link but I'm On my iPod so it's a pain.... Summit carries them... There is also a build were they used the Logan intake on mhs but I'm sure youv seen it
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ShelbyGT

Formally silvergt / Member Plus
#9
#9
i think 380 is possible

just gonna have to be at 7k+ RPM, which will be really fun:)

with a small engine, even a 5.3 mod motor, you're gonna have to spin it hard to get there

unfortunately with the very agressive cams you'll need to make the projected power, you'll need a minimum of 10:1 compression to keep cylinder pressure up at low engine speeds so the engine doesn't feel sluggish. probably need more like 11:1 to be snappy down low, which in turn kinda foils your plan for a SC at a later date.

tough call on that one. maybe do 11:1 for now and then plan on purchasing some 9:1 pistons along with your SC

as far as the intake goes, i'd run a edelbrock victor with an MHS efi elbow.

the bullitt manifold is a good idea but i think you won't need to worry about the low speed torque it'll help maintain over the edelbrock due to the added displacement you'll have

you can't ever go wrong with an edelbrock manifold! plus with the MHS elbow all your stock cables and stuff will still work, in turn keeping you budget down from not nickel and diming you to death for little stuff

just my .02

i love high rev N/A builds!
 
BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#11
#11
Todd ... link only opens the menu, no thread. If it's tt then it's got low cr. Probably 8.5 or 9.0 and turbo cams. 353rwhp isn't terrible.


That's why I'm thinking I can get there with a N/A cams.

Here a 5.3L 3V with a 3.4 Whipple. Fastest dyno pull I've seen to 6600 rpm.

797rwhp / 710rwtq @ only 16lb boost. :rock:


they are the 127550 cam profile. I do start dropping slightly in higher rpm and I just bought the phaser limiter kit from comp and I'm sure it's going to adjust and and make slightly more power. I'm going to instal it next week.

The stock 4.6 will not allow this big of a stroke. This is the FRPP big bore Boss 4.6 iron block. I had it sonic tested to see how much we could take it and then backed down a little for safety. I ended going with a 3.85 stroke and .020 over on the pistons to net exactly 330.4 ci.

I also did it properly on the pistons. They are seriously bad ass. They are custom Diamond pistons that have rings you'd have to see to believe. The were $1600 but they were worth every penny and seriously the best pistons I have ever seen for a 3V.

I am pushing this through a full manual 4r70 with no lock-up or kickdown so I see a whopping loss. This thing is well over 1000 to the fly right now and I'm not going any further on this motor.

I am going to enjoy the hell out of it but I am done with 3V's now. If anything happens to this motor, I am doing a big bore 5.4 4V and stroking it to 360 cim or just putting a big stroked 351 in there...


Hopefully, though, this thing is going to last for quite some time...knock on wood..it's dialed in pretty good and actually very conservative believe it or not. I'm even on the rich side with a/f peaking on 10's at time. It's only max timing of 20º and my a/f never sees over 11.5 through 6800 rpm so it's really conservative but I don't want to get too aggressive on this big stroker for now at least. You know how it is, who knows next year...lol

I am running a pretty big pulley and have nowhere near put this blower to it's limit. Hell, I'm running a 3 1/2" pulley...
Click to expand...
If anyone interested in Chevy Killer's thread ... Finally finished the MONSTER DD!
 
TBapp3

TBapp3

Northern NY Regional Coordinator
#12
#12
God damn iPod always messing with my posts... SMH That was a NA stock bottom end 2v build Bert you see the numbers... TFS heads NA cams and all bolt ons ... If I can get too a computer I will share the link!
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ford20

ford20

Member Plus
Staff member
NYM Staff
#14
#14
BAzombie said:
Todd ... link only opens the menu, no thread. If it's tt then it's got low cr. Probably 8.5 or 9.0 and turbo cams. 353rwhp isn't terrible.


That's why I'm thinking I can get there with a N/A cams.

Here a 5.3L 3V with a 3.4 Whipple. Fastest dyno pull I've seen to 6600 rpm.

797rwhp / 710rwtq @ only 16lb boost. :rock:

Chevy Killer S197 GT 3.4 Whipple - YouTube


If anyone interested in Chevy Killer's thread ... Finally finished the MONSTER DD!
Click to expand...
And he runs 8.932 @ 153.9

Is 380 what the average S/C 2v puts out?
 
BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#16
#16
ford20 said:
Is 380 what the average S/C 2v puts out?
Click to expand...


Like Todd mentioned, it depends on what they're pushing for boost.

I've seen a low of 359rwhp from a 03GT, full bolt ons w/ VortecV1S trim. To a 96GT with an On3 turbo making 460RWHP.

But yeah, 375-400 whp is about average. If I can hit that N/A ... that's a hell of a base platform. :D
 
BAzombie

BAzombie

Well-Known Member
#17
#17
Found a couple vid to keep me hoping ... :D

Neither video mentions the RPM that they spin the motors to.


This one makes me wonder. Doesn't say what he uses for an intake and I don't want to go 11.3/1 CR :(

2001 bullitt, 324 ci big bore stroker, 11:3 compression, tfs 38cc heads, mhs stage 4 tfs n/a cam
Click to expand...


This one gives me more hope. No CR given on the build.

JMS Big Bore 2v 5.3L Engine, Stage 3 Heads
Stage 3 Cams, Typhoon Intake, 75mm TB
Click to expand...
 
TBapp3

TBapp3

Northern NY Regional Coordinator
#18
#18
Very inspirering videos Bert! I was thinking and rembered herring of this intake... I don't know to much about it as for how high they rev with them but a member on here whitevert ran a 11.9x using one with his NA stock long blocl 2v look him up on here he has a video! Fox Lake p51 modular intake
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ford20

ford20

Member Plus
Staff member
NYM Staff
#20
#20
I was just reading that FRPP may be coming out with the 5.8 block from the GT500 which would net you even more HP. IDK what heads you would be able to run with that though, just food for thought if it is true
 
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