87 5.0 won't start - ignition ok, fuel pump ok

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mmp142965

New Member
#1
#1
Hey guys,

I did some searching to see if I could find anything like this, but unfortunately I think the situation is a little unique. The wiring in the car is hacked up pretty good, and from what I can tell the injectors aren't firing. This is why I say this...

1 - The engine fires up for a second or two with starter fluid or carb cleaner

2 - The guy I bought it from said the first computer was bad, so he got another one. I have both, not sure which is the good one. Maybe none are good.

The fuel pump comes on when you turn the ign key to the "on" position, but does not shut off after a few seconds... it remains on as long as the key is on. Also, the fuel pump only comes on with 1 of the 2 computers, which I am just assuming is the good one.

If anyone has any ideas as to what to look for, I'm somewhat decent with a multimeter and wiring diagrams. It looks like you guys have a ton of them on here which is also really cool.

Let me know what you think, thanks!

Chris
 
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SSChris NY.

SSChris NY.

Member Plus
#2
#2
Did You check to see if the injectors are firing up, they have a tester for this, also check the fuel inertia switch in the trunk, make sure all your fusible links are good on the main engine wiring harness with a positive probe or light tester and last but not least check all the fuses on both fuse boxes, one should be in the engine compartment and the other should be inside the car on the drivers side opposite to were your ecm aka computer is. By the way, the fuel pump on your ride should always be on when the switch is on the start position, your Ride has a return style fuel system, I hope this helps U out and just keep us up to date on the progress.
 
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M

mmp142965

New Member
#3
#3
SSChris NY. said:
Did You check to see if the injectors are firing up, they have a tester for this, also check the fuel inertia switch in the trunk, make sure all your fusible links are good on the main engine wiring harness with a positive probe or light tester and last but not least check all the fuses on both fuse boxes, one should be in the engine compartment and the other should be inside the car on the drivers side opposite to were your ecm aka computer is. By the way, the fuel pump on your ride should always be on when the switch is on the start position, your Ride has a return style fuel system, I hope this helps U out and just keep us up to date on the progress.
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Thanks man, I'll check that stuff tomorrow. I don't think the injectors are firing, ill have to get that special tester to see. Also I haven't seen a fuse box under the hood, and there are a lot of connectors that aren't plugged into anything. I think tomorrow I'll take some pics of all of that. Thanks again
 
T

toomanytoys

Well-Known Member
#4
#4
Your car is an 87, there is no fusebox under the hood. The fuelpump should only prime at the first turn of the key. If you put the key into the run position from off then the pump should come on for about 2-3 seconds.The pump is not supposed to stay on if the car isnt running. If yours is staying on then I would say both ecm's are bad. The tool you need to verify injector pulse is a noid light. Lastly is this car still speed density ? Youre not using the wrong ecm right?
 
M

mmp142965

New Member
#5
#5
toomanytoys said:
Your car is an 87, there is no fusebox under the hood. The fuelpump should only prime at the first turn of the key. If you put the key into the run position from off then the pump should come on for about 2-3 seconds.The pump is not supposed to stay on if the car isnt running. If yours is staying on then I would say both ecm's are bad. The tool you need to verify injector pulse is a noid light. Lastly is this car still speed density ? Youre not using the wrong ecm right?
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Yes, the car is speed density. There is a possibility that both ecms are bad and or wrong. I'm not really sure what to look for to identify them. The fuel pump will stay on indefinitely as long as the key is on, not just a quick prime. Ill do some tests tonight and take some pics. Thanks!
 
jkstang78

jkstang78

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
Well, I only have the code for the computer from 88 & up, I don't know if 87 was the same

'88 manual trans ECU code : 8LD
'88 auto trans ECU code : 8LF

and 89&up are the year that they switch to mass air, so mostly auto ECU was A9P and manual ECU was A9L

Hope this helps!

Also More info that will help with the ECUS

http://fordfuelinjection.com/index.php?p=17
 
M

mmp142965

New Member
#9
#9
toomanytoys said:
Just a really stupid question here: The car has gas in it right? Dont just go by the guage...
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actually its not that stupid of a question. Its usually the first one I ask when someone tells me their car doesn't start.:)

I put 5 gallons of 93 in it. I tried to siphon out the old gas first but im guessing it didnt have much in the tank because the siphon tube didn't even get wet. I also checked for some kind of fuel pressure at the schrader valve on the rail and it shot all over my hand.
 
M

mmp142965

New Member
#11
#11
Ok I took some pics of the car and the wiring, here they are below. There are several connectors that don't go to anything, and I'm wondering if that is part of the problem. Also, one computer is for a taurus and the other one is an A9L. So neither is correct. :awesomework: .

Should I stick with speed density and get the computer or keep the A9L and get the Mass air meter?

Also a friend suggested the dist module because it sends a pulse to the injectors.

I am going to go through the wiring tomorrow. Thanks for all the help so far!


 
jkstang78

jkstang78

Well-Known Member
#12
#12
Ok well since both ecus are wrong that is the first problem. I'll have to check the pics of the wiring tomorrow. I'm on a iPod touch right now and can't see them to well.
 
jkstang78

jkstang78

Well-Known Member
#13
#13
These pics look normal. That is the way it is suspose to be Most are just for test.
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture%20090.jpg
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 089.jpg

This is for a DA15.087 MustangSD-SFI / Manual (see note 1)
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 100.jpg
This is a mass air computer
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 097.jpg

This goes into the back of the Heating/AC controls. Should not affect a car running.
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 101.jpg

This for the raido
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 102.jpg

One of these is for remote mirros that other I want to say for the cigaret lighter
http://gofastgoods.us/images/mustang/Picture 103.jpg

Man you have a job ahead of you. It might be saier to find a wrecked mustang and pull the wiring from Head light to tail light and change everything over. That is really messy
 
M

mmp142965

New Member
#14
#14
erg yea it looks that way. I was thinking about just getting the painless efi harness for the mass air mustang, and the painless chassis harness. Then id have to do the mass air conversion though. I wish I could just get it to run before I have to do all of that. Thanks for the help!
 
TheWhiteFox

TheWhiteFox

Member
#15
#15
I believe the ecu you are looking for will say (DC) on it this is 87-88 non-mass air auto 5.0, someone else here maybe able to verify that, IMO I would go with the A9L computer and get the mass air conversion, you can get both harness on ebay pretty cheap
 
jkstang78

jkstang78

Well-Known Member
#17
#17
http://www.mass-air.com/Products.htm

Mass-Air Harnesses - We've Sold More Than Anyone!!

IST has convert
ed more cars to Mass-Air than anyone!! Over 20,000 harnesses and computer kits sold to date, with no end in sight!! If you want to convert a Speed Density engine to a Mass-Air engine, IST’s LOW-COST conversion harness is the answer. All harnesses designed for speed density Mustang, Thunderbird, Cougar, Mark VII, Crown Victoria, Grand Marquis, & Town Car. Will not work on trucks, see truck conversion kits. Why convert to Mass-Air in the first place?? Simple, on a totally stock car engine, you will generally pick up 2 - 3 MPG, along with much crisper throttle response. On modified engines, it's mandatory, since the stock Speed Density computer has a very small "window" of adjustment built in to handle those changes. Even if you have modified your stock engine and it still seems to run OK, you still are not getting the maximum benefit from all those expensive aftermarket parts you put on. Plus, you have the added benefit of cleaner emissions, since most Speed Density systems tend to run on the rich side. This true OEM-style and quality kit allows you to custom tailor the harness to the exact length you need. Plus you'll find competent, friendly, and FREE technical support is provided for all of our products. We'll work with you to try and solve any problem you may encounter!!
Part Number CH-8611-F, for OBD-I EEC-IV connectors (4 terminal oval)……....................................$39.95 That is what you need and is cheap. Ran 2 cars with that kit ove 6 years no problems
 
M

mmp142965

New Member
#18
#18
Thanks to the advice from those who responded, I was able to start up my mustang for the first time tonight. Of the 2 ecus provided when I bought it, none were the correct ones for the car. I got the older style 87-88 (DC) speed density computer for $50 and the thing starts up and runs... kinda.

It sounds really loud and mean when it does run, guessing the headers and big exhaust have a lot to do with that. Also, the fuel pump primes for a few seconds a shuts off now (correct ecu.) That's about where the good news tapers off though. It pours black smoke when I revved it up, and won't idle. Also, sounds/feels like a big cam, or a few cylinders not firing. I'm betting on the latter.

I am going to get some new plugs tomorrow and tinker with it a little bit. Im pretty sure the computer is a stock tune, the injectors are yellow, and there is no after market fuel pressure regulator. The fuel pump may be high volume but I'm just saying that because its really loud.

I am going to check the compression tomorrow as well. If that is ok maybe some of the sensors are bad? Coolant temp?

You guys have been a great help so far. If you have any tips on getting it to run better let me know. Once I can get it running and drivable, I'll look into the mass air conversion, it sounds like its the way to go. Thanks guys! :rock:
 
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T

toomanytoys

Well-Known Member
#19
#19
If that car has a cam in it, it will not run right with a speed density system. As far as bad sensors go, the ACT will make the car puke black smoke if it is bad.
 
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